【云德访谈】精英律师院长说访谈系列|程淑娟——精英律师所应当具备的素养及特质

程淑娟，西北政法大学民商法学院副院长、法学教授、博士生导师，中国法学会民法学研究会常务理事，陕西省法学会民法学研究会副会长、秘书长，西安仲裁委员会仲裁员、专家咨询委员会委员，2015年入选陕西省首批高校人文社科英才计划，主要研究领域为民法物权法、债权法和商法基础理论等（国际金融法律学院）。

Cheng Shujuan, Vice President of Northwest University of Politics and Law School of Civil and Commercial Law, Professor of Law, Doctoral Supervisor, Executive Director of China Law Society Institute of Civil Law, Vice Chairman and Secretary General of the Civil Law Research Association of Shaanxi Law Society, Arbitrator of Xi'an Arbitration Commission and Member of Expert Advisory Committee, were selected into the first batch of humanities and social sciences talents program in Shaanxi Province in 2015. Their main research fields are civil law, property law, creditor's rights law and basic theories of commercial law (International Institute of Finance and Law).

Q：程院长您好！感谢您来参加云德律师学院首届院长论坛，根据您之前对云德律所的了解，以及今天听完云德律师学院的介绍后，您对云德律所的发展模式有着怎样的看法？

Glad to see you, Dean Cheng! Thank you for coming to the first Dean's Forum of Yunde Law Firm. According to your previous understanding of Yunde Law Firm and after listening to the introduction of Yunde Law Firm today, what do you think of the development mode of Yunde Law Firm?

A：首先非常荣幸能够参加本次云德律师学院首届院长论坛，也衷心地向丁云波主任表示祝贺，陕西云德律师事务所成立10周年，这10年西北政法大学民商法学院与云德律所也是紧密合作、共谋发展，我本人也很荣幸在2017、2018年都参加了云德律所举办的律所管理论坛，对于云德律所的发展模式，我的感受是云德律所自成立至今的发展理念都十分明确、发展思路也非常清晰，并且是一个执行力非常强的律所。在云德律所通过律师学院自我输送的过程中，也是培养出很多的精英律师。

First of all, I am very honored to be able to participate in the first Dean's Forum of Yunde Law College. I would also like to express my heartfelt congratulations to Director Ding Yunbo. The 10th Anniversary of Shaanxi Yunde Law Firm, In the past 10 years, Northwest University of Politics and Law School of Civil and Commercial Law and Yunde Law Firm have also worked closely together to seek common development. I am also very honored to participate in the law firm management forums held by Yunde Law Firm in 2017 and 2018. As for the development mode of Yunde Law Firm, my feeling is that the development concept of Yunde Law Firm since its establishment is very clear, the development thinking is also very clear, and it is a law firm with very strong execution. In the process of self-transmission through the Law Institute, Yunde Law Firm has also trained many elite lawyers.

Q：今天院长论坛的主题是精英律师研讨会，探讨律师如何从平凡走向卓越，您是否可以谈谈您所认为的精英律师应当具有怎样的素质和特性？

The theme of today's Dean's Forum is the Elite Lawyers Seminar, which discusses how lawyers can move from ordinary to outstanding. Can you talk about what qualities and characteristics do you think elite lawyers should have?

A:谈及律师行业我也是有一些想法，律师行业对身体和心理的要求较高，因为平时的工作强度大，节奏快，一定得非常健康，基本身体体力很重要。关于心理健康，因为平常接触的案件的原因，当事人往往处于各种纠纷与压力之中，对于此律师的确需要保持一个阳光健康的心态，这是非常重要的，否则从事律师行业如果将我们自己带入到当事人的情绪之中，那么作为律师乐趣在哪呢？所以这一点很重要。

When it comes to the lawyer industry, I also have some ideas. The lawyer industry has higher physical and psychological requirements, because the usual work intensity is high and the pace is fast. It must be very healthy and the basic physical strength is very important. With regard to mental health, the parties are often in various disputes and pressures due to the reasons of the cases they come into contact with. It is very important for this lawyer to maintain a healthy state of mind. Otherwise, if we are engaged in the lawyer industry and bring ourselves into the emotions of the parties, what is the pleasure of being a lawyer? So this is very important.

第二点，我觉得作为一名精英律师最重要的还是自己的专业能力，专业能力一方面是我们学了多少，另一方面最重要的是我们不断学习不断自我成长的能力。包括今天在座的所有嘉宾，可能从谈吐之中别人就能看出，你读了多少书，你懂多少，你的阅历如何，这些别人是一清二楚的。所以我认为律师作为一个需要不断成长的行业的确需要求大家不断地学习，不断提高自我。像在2019年，中国不管立法机关也好，司法机关也好，不断地在出台新规则，第九次全国法院民商事审判工作会议印发会议纪要（简称九民纪要）有130条，同时新修订了证据规则（最高人民法院关于修改《关于民事诉讼证据的若干规定》的决定），更大一点的法律变动就是《中华人民共和国民法典》即将出台，它将导致合同法、物权法、担保法这些法律的修改与变动，所以说律师学习的压力是特别重的。

Secondly, I think as an elite lawyer, the most important thing is our professional ability. On the one hand, our professional ability is how much we have learned, and on the other hand, the most important thing is our ability to continuously learn and grow up. Including all the guests present today, others may be able to see from their speech how many books you have read, how much you know and how much you have experienced. These others know very well. Therefore, I think lawyers, as an industry that needs continuous growth, really need to require everyone to continuously learn and improve themselves. Like in 2019, No matter the legislature or the legislature, The judiciary, New rules are constantly being issued, The Ninth National Court Conference on Civil and Commercial Trials issued 130 minutes . At the same time, the Rules of Evidence have been newly revised (the Decision of the Supreme People's Court on Amending "Several Provisions on Evidence in Civil Proceedings"). The bigger legal change is the imminent promulgation of the Civil Code of the People's Republic of China, which will lead to the revision and change of the Contract Law, Property Law and Guarantee Law. Therefore, the pressure on lawyers to study is especially heavy.

第三点，我理解的精英律师还包括情商方面的要求，因为律师是一种与人打交道的行业，说话的艺术尤为重要，如何说？怎么说？既能让自己开心，又能让对方开心，这个能力也是云德律师学院一直培养的方向，刚才翻看了律师学院的笔记本，丁云波主任已经把这方面的内容面向青年律师进行了培养，相对于其他律所做的是非常到位的。

Third, the elite lawyers I understand also include emotional intelligence requirements, because lawyers are an industry that deals with people, and the art of speaking is especially important. How to say ? What to   say? It can not only make oneself happy, but also make the other party happy. This ability is also the direction that Yunde Law College has been cultivating. Just now I read the notebook of the College. Director Ding Yunbo has already trained young lawyers in this aspect, which is very in place compared with what other law firms have done.

第四点，精英律师最重要的是德的问题。律师的价值是多元化的，如何在保持行业基本盈利生存的基础上同时坚守律师的职业素养，也就是坚守律师行业的不忘初心，所以各个方面需要我们更多的思考。

Fourth, the most important thing for elite lawyers is morality. The value of lawyers is diversified. How to stick to the professional quality of lawyers while maintaining the basic profitability of the industry, that is, to stick to Do not forget your initiative mind of the lawyer industry, so we need to think more about all aspects.

Q：感谢程院长！

Q: Thank you, Dean Cheng!